2.2 10v Turbo - Engine Code MC - Whats Different to UR 10v Turbos

[Quattro Power]

Hi,

While reading my "Audi Quattro Book - Buying, repairing and tuning" book I found out that the original UR engine was based on the 200 10v turbo engine and with the addition of an intercooler it gave the engine that 20-30 bhp more as the 200. This would have been at the start of the 80's so it would have been the old type 43 200's.

I have a 1990 Audi 100 10v Turbo, which has an engine code MC, and I believe that the later models had two knock sensors making the engine code MC-2.

Basically what I want is the power of a UR, so roughly 200 - 220 Bhp would be fine, and wondered if I could source original UR parts which parts would fit? I know that the MC engine is easily tunable after reading through the pages of the www.034motorsport.com website. However rather than spending a fortune on new turbos, manifolds, wastegate, injectors, intercoolers and EFI systems I'd rather keep my eye going for second hand parts if its possible.......

Anyone with any advice, comments, knowledge, could you please point me in the right direction?

Thanks,
Leigh

[4v6]

Tis true the Ur engine is basically the same as fitted to the early 2005T.

The 5T didnt have the intercooler fitted as for some reason 170bhp was probably deemed an outrageous amount to have coursing through the front wheels, The front wheels he says! of whats a pretty luxurious crusier, even now. Id still have one!

The intercooler allowed the boost pressure to be raised without the engine being prone to detonation, which is likely when you start to ask for more, powerwise when you dont have it as the air temps go up.
Maybe it wasnt deemed practical due to space constraints in the 5T at the time also.

Id say youd be able to use the necessary parts from an Ur to get that 200bhp figure without any hassle at all as its already been done for you by Audi.
Basically a case of finding what youll need, transferring it over and getting it set up.

[pimpdriver]

get yours rolling roaded first, you may be surprised!

Audi couldn't have the "boring old fart's car" with the same power as the "super" sports car now could they!

Hence why the lowly 100 is 165bhp, the 200 is 182bhp (though faster in a straight line than a ur).

Gib has thoughts on this. Something to do with a waste gate spring.

[Puglife]

Lower boost pressure combined with no intercooler. Essentially same engine, i think compression ratio may have been different though? WR intercooler and more boost will give 200bhp easily

[pimpdriver]

Originally Posted by Puglife

Lower boost pressure combined with no intercooler. Essentially same engine, i think compression ratio may have been different though? WR intercooler and more boost will give 200bhp easily

My 100 turbo has an intercooler, just behind the grille

[Quattro Power]

Originally Posted by BasilNZ

If you can find Phil Payne (sometimes on the quattroforum), he knows how to make well over 200bhp from the MC.

Originally Posted by Puglife

Lower boost pressure combined with no intercooler. Essentially same engine, i think compression ratio may have been different though? WR intercooler and more boost will give 200bhp easily

Maybe the answer lies somewhere between your replies boys, The Audi 100 Turbo has an intercooler just not up to the same Spec as a UR Intercooler. As for finding one to put on I suppose it doesn’t really matter which one I ram in there as long as its big enough and efficient enough to lower the intake temperature which should = more hp……….I think I’ll send 034motorsport and email on this to see what they recommend!

How would I go about increasing the boost though? I suppose I could just look out for a S2 / URS4 K24 turbo on ebay, or at the breakers and bolt that on, if it would fit?

There’s all sorts of talk on that 034motorsport website about this EFI engine management system which is available for about £800. They all seem to be slagging off the “original CIS system”, is this the Bosch K or KE Jectronic fueling system? I always thought that the K Jectronic was meant to be quite a good system, relatively simple and even used by Porsche in the old 911!

There was a couple of MC engines that had been tuned in the customers cars section and I printed out the two that stood out the most, one which had been heavily modified to quite an expense and the other who hadn’t really changed very much. Here’s the lists;

Heavily Modified MC Engine;
10v T Exhaust Manifold £697.27
3 Inch Down-pipe £329.36
EFI Stage IIc £1,226.35
EFI Plug in Harness £416.96
GT3071R Turbo £963.56
EFI DIS High Output Coils £240.01
EFI Fuel Rail £80.59
Bosch 42 Injectors £218.99
UR Q Intercooler Hose Kit £192.71
Vortex Catch Can £54.66

TOTAL £4,420.46


Least Modified MC Engine;
EFI Stage Iib £805.89
K26 / T04E Hybrid Turbo £487.04
EFI Radiator £501.05

TOTAL £1,793.97

I’ve just remembered that there was a thread on edition38.com about a guy who tuned up an Audi 200 10v T, maybe there’s some pointers on there, I think I’ll get my note-pad and pen out at dinner time and read it through. Here’s the link if anyone’s interested - http://www.edition38.com/forums/inde...03&hl=Audi+200

Originally Posted by pimpdriver

My 100 turbo has an intercooler, just behind the grille

I’ve just became a member on the quattroforum yesterday so I’ll maybe PM him, see if he wants to enlighten me. Whatever way I do go I will be sure to post which components were upgraded and the results from that.

Cheers!

[Quattro Power]

After reading a bit more in the tuning section this came up, it relates to the WR & MB engines but shows what sorts of gains can be had from tuning, these facts were courtesy of BR Motorsport.

To get 240 BHP out of your WR or MB all you need to do is to get your;
Cylinder Head – Gas flowed with re-profiled valve seats, etc.
Inlet & Exhaust Manifolds – Gas flowed to match ports in head.

To get 260 BHP out of your WR or MB all you need to do is to;
Fit RS2 Turbo or Hybrid Turbo to the Standard Exhaust Manifold.


Another little bit of wisdom was that the stainless pipe, which runs from the waste gate under the manifold to the turbo is notorious for choking up and results in reduced boost and therefore reduced performance. It would be an idea to check that first or just replace it!

I found a little step-to-step guide to waste gate tuning (Again relating to WR & MB but surely can’t be that much different), here it is;
· Remove the six nuts from the top of the waste gate cover (the last two have to be removed whilst holding the cap because of the pressure from the spring beneath could blast it off as the nuts come off the last few threads.
Apply lots of easing agent as these studs often corrode and snap (a broken stud could be drilled out, though there would be a danger of swarf falling down the waste gate).
· Drill out the protective cap in the centre of the waste gate to give access to the allen-headed adjuster screw (use a heat gun to melt the factory-applied loctite. NOTE – the WR & MB waste gates are different and are NOT interchangeable)
· Inside the waste gate cap there’s a plate attached to the screw – it often corrodes solid and needs encouraging free.
· Install a new up-rated spring, which exerts more pressure, the more pressure the harder it for the waste gate to come into play and the more boost gets to the engine!


Will see if I can find out more at dinner on the aforementioned Edition38 thread

[steveb]

200's with the 182bhp KG engine have an intercooler, sits in front of the cam belt bigger than the ur item as well

[Scarlet]

my mc 2.2 turbo engine has an intercooler behind the grill although its tiny!

I was going to get a massvie one and bolt it to the bumper there was a 100 avnt on youtube like this a while back and it looked quite cool but it does take away the smooth lines from the car

[Quattro Power]

Originally Posted by Scarlet

my mc 2.2 turbo engine has an intercooler behind the grill although its tiny!

I was going to get a massvie one and bolt it to the bumper there was a 100 avnt on youtube like this a while back and it looked quite cool but it does take away the smooth lines from the car

I remember reading in practical performance car mag about this guy who had a UR quattro, he'd stuck a dirty great big tuned up AAN 20v engine in it anyway, what he reckoned was the best thing to do is rather than sticking a great big intercooler in put two smaller intercoolers in instead. The bigger the intercooler the less forced pressure which results in LOSS of power.
I don't know that much about it but the engine had been built with the help of the imfamous Aelred Smith Audi freak guy (I think he originally set up Dialynx with Keith Murray), and they'd done a damned good job too because the stats were 0-70 mph in 5.8 secs, that's 1.2 sec FASTER than an RS4, and he could run 2.5 bar of boost but was only running 1.8-2.0 bar at the time!!