not firing up, getting desperate now... - Page 2

Micky · 26-12-12, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martinws

If it didn't even fart with easy start then sounds like spark problem.

if sparks then a major problem

mine was left for only 10 years and the water eaten away my cylinder walls

try a compression test aswell

if spark fuel and compression ok and timing it should start

missfire · 26-12-12, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martinws

If it didn't even fart with easy start then sounds like spark problem.

Sounds like more than one problem,lol. Fuel pump pooped maybe, but as Martin says, engine earth straps/rusty, if its cranking slow and not a great spark?

Run a jump lead from the negative terminal of the battery to the starter housing/bell housing/engine block, and see what happens.

McLarenboy · 27-12-12, 11:50 AM

I see fuel appearing in the filter when trying to start, after stopping it just drains away.

I've just took off the carb and seperated the two pieces, cleaned it up. Nothing really out of the ordinary except for some coolant which had cristalized. I'll be putting in some fresh fuel and reinstall it to see what'll happen now.

If the timing were to be out then surely it would start but run rough, correct?

maxustaxus · 27-12-12, 01:16 PM

Well, I think timing can be so far out that it may not start at all. But that would beg the question how had this happened since storage (possible I know but...)

Personally, I would be more concerned about the sluggish turnover before looking at this..

If for some reason the electric current is drained or under heavy load (i.e., trying to turn a stiff engine that has been standing or a starter motor that has not been used for a while, or whatever), then the spark may show but not be strong enough to fire, especially if other conditions are not perfect (i.e., at a very low engine turnover the carb is unlikely to work effeciently anyway).

In this situation with old rootes engines, I remove at least two spark plugs, and try to start on just two cylinders having MADE SURE fresh petrol is down the inlet manifold (i.e., has definately got past the carb, remove a plug to sniff for petrol to check that it is getting this far and into the cylinder). And I would do this with a jump start from another car as well, if you can, to get the best engine spin possible.

This means you get a fast turn over and can be fairly sure you have petrol and a strong enough spark to hear at least a couple of cylinders fire up if nothing else is wrong (because you can see the removed two plugs spark at the same time, but don't forget which belongs with which cylinder, and of course it is not a good thing to run an engine this way so if you get signs of life switch of and replace all plugs and try again). If it will only run like this for a short while then fuel flow might be my next move. If it won't fire at all then I may move to compression and/or the ignition circuits including timing in case corrosion or standing has caused some unexpected problem.

Hang in there....it is just a question of eliminating each thing it can't be one by one.

Mike Boston · 27-12-12, 01:58 PM

hi
its only metal and its not going to win i tell myself sometimes.
you're getting some good advise and its only a matter of time now before you sort it
im not a mechanic but speed of cranking is very important especially when its not run for so long, use a heavy battery charger if you have to.
I cant understand why you have a spark and some easystart down the carb while cranking doesnt cause a cough.(check compression?)
it somethimes helps to go through everything you have altered and re check just in case you missed something.
mike

McLarenboy · 27-12-12, 08:28 PM

Well indeed i'm getting closer - after putting the carb back in the car it's now injecting fuel when i press the pedal. While trying to start it's now coughing a little bit but still not starting.

I recharged the battery and then hooked another bigger battery onto it but to no avail.

Maybe a teaspoon of oil in each cilinder?

moonwatcher · 27-12-12, 09:41 PM

Try some WD40 instead of "easy start" WHILE some else is starting the car, again watch for a blow back

martinws · 27-12-12, 09:48 PM

I'm a fan of a few drops of petrol down the carb but care must be taken of the eyebrows if it backfires through the inlet.haha!

moonwatcher · 27-12-12, 10:05 PM

WD40 (atomised oil) sprayed down the inlet while turning over is as good as petrol, it lubes as well

McLarenboy · 04-01-13, 08:54 PM

Well it finally fired up. But i simply had to bring in an Audi-technician with some 40 years experience.

So i changed the cambelt and fitted it according to the marks on the engine, which was also explained in the workshop manual. But it turns out that was wrong !?!

So now the cambelt has been fitted correctly but now the markings on the crankshaft really don't align. So in that way i would never have been able to find that out. I'll be posting a picture to explain the situation along with a short clip of the engine. It runs really nice but there is sort of a weird noise coming from the delco area, sounds like a supercharged engine when you give it some gas.

27-12-12, 09:41 PM	#17
moonwatcher 4 ring whore! Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Barrow in Furness, Cumbria Posts: 2,049	Try some WD40 instead of "easy start" WHILE some else is starting the car, again watch for a blow back __________________ Coupe Quattro 1985

27-12-12, 10:05 PM	#19
moonwatcher 4 ring whore! Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Barrow in Furness, Cumbria Posts: 2,049	WD40 (atomised oil) sprayed down the inlet while turning over is as good as petrol, it lubes as well __________________ Coupe Quattro 1985

27-12-12, 11:50 AM	#13
McLarenboy Grown up member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 184	I see fuel appearing in the filter when trying to start, after stopping it just drains away. I've just took off the carb and seperated the two pieces, cleaned it up. Nothing really out of the ordinary except for some coolant which had cristalized. I'll be putting in some fresh fuel and reinstall it to see what'll happen now. If the timing were to be out then surely it would start but run rough, correct?

27-12-12, 01:16 PM	#14
maxustaxus Grown up member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 198	Well, I think timing can be so far out that it may not start at all. But that would beg the question how had this happened since storage (possible I know but...) Personally, I would be more concerned about the sluggish turnover before looking at this.. If for some reason the electric current is drained or under heavy load (i.e., trying to turn a stiff engine that has been standing or a starter motor that has not been used for a while, or whatever), then the spark may show but not be strong enough to fire, especially if other conditions are not perfect (i.e., at a very low engine turnover the carb is unlikely to work effeciently anyway). In this situation with old rootes engines, I remove at least two spark plugs, and try to start on just two cylinders having MADE SURE fresh petrol is down the inlet manifold (i.e., has definately got past the carb, remove a plug to sniff for petrol to check that it is getting this far and into the cylinder). And I would do this with a jump start from another car as well, if you can, to get the best engine spin possible. This means you get a fast turn over and can be fairly sure you have petrol and a strong enough spark to hear at least a couple of cylinders fire up if nothing else is wrong (because you can see the removed two plugs spark at the same time, but don't forget which belongs with which cylinder, and of course it is not a good thing to run an engine this way so if you get signs of life switch of and replace all plugs and try again). If it will only run like this for a short while then fuel flow might be my next move. If it won't fire at all then I may move to compression and/or the ignition circuits including timing in case corrosion or standing has caused some unexpected problem. Hang in there....it is just a question of eliminating each thing it can't be one by one.

27-12-12, 01:58 PM	#15
Mike Boston Grown up member Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 26	hi its only metal and its not going to win i tell myself sometimes. you're getting some good advise and its only a matter of time now before you sort it im not a mechanic but speed of cranking is very important especially when its not run for so long, use a heavy battery charger if you have to. I cant understand why you have a spark and some easystart down the carb while cranking doesnt cause a cough.(check compression?) it somethimes helps to go through everything you have altered and re check just in case you missed something. mike

27-12-12, 08:28 PM	#16
McLarenboy Grown up member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 184	Well indeed i'm getting closer - after putting the carb back in the car it's now injecting fuel when i press the pedal. While trying to start it's now coughing a little bit but still not starting. I recharged the battery and then hooked another bigger battery onto it but to no avail. Maybe a teaspoon of oil in each cilinder?

27-12-12, 09:48 PM	#18
martinws Grown up member Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Johnstone Posts: 723	I'm a fan of a few drops of petrol down the carb but care must be taken of the eyebrows if it backfires through the inlet.haha!

04-01-13, 08:54 PM	#20
McLarenboy Grown up member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 184	Well it finally fired up. But i simply had to bring in an Audi-technician with some 40 years experience. So i changed the cambelt and fitted it according to the marks on the engine, which was also explained in the workshop manual. But it turns out that was wrong !?! So now the cambelt has been fitted correctly but now the markings on the crankshaft really don't align. So in that way i would never have been able to find that out. I'll be posting a picture to explain the situation along with a short clip of the engine. It runs really nice but there is sort of a weird noise coming from the delco area, sounds like a supercharged engine when you give it some gas.