FUEL PUMP RELAY for Audi 200
 

The garage reported to me:
"We cannot initiate the diagnostic program because the fuel pump relay has been changed for an aftermarket one. It is meant to have a socket on the top of it in which a fuse is temporarily fitted to initiate the diagnostics. The relay fitted is an off the shelf one."

The car is an '87 Audi 200 AVANT Quattro Turbo [2.2 petrol injection, manual gearbox]

Does anyone have the original relay for sale, please?

Sounds like you need relay 215


Still readily available

Thanks. Do you mean that you can still buy them new?

Any suggestions where I can get one?

Audi?

Flippant, I know, but you'd be surprised how much you can still get, and at reasonable cost compared to Internet auctions.


(24) 8A0951253
contact close relay / for fuel pump / relay location: / F >> 44-F-300 000*
10 / KG,JY
(24) 191906383C
contact close relay / for fuel pump / relay location: / F 44-G-000 001>>*
10 / KG,JY

It might be one of those, but I won't be able to check for a few days. I do have a couple somewhere which need fixing.

Tell them to straighten out their curved hands, or change garage to one where works smarter folk. L line, which they want to ground by plugging in fuse, is also connected to diagnostic connectors, found somewhere in drivers footwell, I presume, so all is needed in this case, is just small piece of wire to connect two pins. Actually I'm wondering what they want to achieve - did UK C3's came with check engine light installed?

In case if you still want to change relay - not only 215, but also 213 could be used. 215 is higher rated version of 213, I guess it was used for engines where it had to handle not only fuel pump, but also injectors - 20v/20vt engines.

There are a few unique aspects to the right hand drive set-ups compared with their original left hand drive counterparts. So, such simple items as fitting a bulb in the check engine light position doesn't actually work in some cases as possibly no such thing exists on RHD, while left hand drive has it. (Thinking V8 diagnostics, for an example)

But the check light still requires a trigger, doesn't it? Which is the two contacts in te lid of the relay.

Btw. If someone identifies the correct relay, I'll edit my previous post accordingly.

Great advice -thanks Gents!

I think I need to order this one, unless anyone advises otherwise...

Audi No 215 Contact Close Relay - Part Number 443951253l
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-No-21...-/281420378037

That's what I'm talking about. German market cars as far as I've seen doesn't have check engine light circuitry in dash harness, although the hardware involved supports this - I'm wondering if it's different for RHD cars - after all, fuse socket in pump relay is for two reasons - 1) to conveniently bring engine management into service mode 2) to conveniently read self diagnostic faults - in case if there's no check engine light, it still involves diagnostic connectors...

Reading a discussion on the subject for the V8 on a U.S. Site, it transpired that on North American market cars, (whether all, or just certain m.y chassis, I don't know), the check engine light bulb was omitted, but otherwise all of the circuitry was present.
For commonality, there was little mention of its function, but someone found out by trial and error, that fitting the bulb in the dash permanently allowed the blink codes to display on the dash, instead of messing about hanging upside in the footwell prodding bits of random wire in holes.

At least, that's how I understood it. (There was still some prodding, but not so much) I had to read between the lines of americanglish, so some of it might have been lost in translation.

To John Clayton, I should say-
One point of caution in your original post on this topic, is the 'accessing the diagnostic program.'

It's not quite that advanced. If your garage are expecting some wizard output that says 'code/sensor FUBAR', they might be sorely disappointed.

What actually comes out is a four character blink code. That is then referenced to a table by the very human part of the diagnostic program, ie. the Technician, or the Technicians Monkey, which will give a very broad reference to a sensor not giving a correct output.
It's fun, but archaic.

There's some notes about this (MAC05) on Phil Paynes Isham research website.


Two notes-
Autocorrect has a slightly Freudian aspect to its function, me thinks;
FUBAR autocorrects to 'Dubai', and Isham to Islam.
Neither of which have any practical value in this discussion, btw.

That's the same relay that I have in my MB quattro which uses the same setup for code reading.

Google search shows both to be without fuse socket :) Apparently the difference between both might be power rating.

Interesting. I pulled those numbers from Vagcat!

I found the info you mentioned above...

http://www.isham-research.co.uk/quattro/tech.html#elec

Am I right in saying that the sub-pages relevant to my car's engine are as follows?
MB ECU codes, diagnostics and pinouts
MB ECU self-diagnosis

I think I took similar(same) relay from an ng engined coupe last week
Will see if I can find it

If you have a 1B engine then yes, the MB instructions are correct for your car

Being a 1987 vehicle, wouldn't it be KG engined, still?

The kg engine doesn't use that relay though.

It's a different method for reading codes

http://www.isham-research.co.uk/quattro/codes_kg.html

How can I tell whether my engine is KG or 1B? Based upon the fact that it needs the specified relay for its fault codes, am I right in saying that it must therefore be a 1B engine?

Will be on your V5 or also on the side of the block.

it could be the garage are talking out their arse

According to the V5 the engine no. is: KG022506

so you were right!

clumsily cut and paste from Phil Paynes website; The UK quattro Network


Audi KG turbo engine MAC05 error codes

(You need these working)
Check idle and full throttle switches on throttle body working
Check brake lights working

(This will get the vehicle to a state where any potential faults can generate a code)
Test drive vehicle, attempting to recreate problem condition - minimum 10 minutes, above 80°C, 3,000 rpm and 1.2 bar if possible; accelerate hard in 3rd gear
Leave engine running
If engine will not start, turn on starter for five seconds and leave ignition on
Reading codes erases them - to repeat, repeat test drive

(This bit is how you set the car to output the fault codes)
Remove throttle switch cover or attach remote WOT switch lead
Close full throttle switch by hand or remote WOT switch for ten seconds
Tachometer should read 7000 - "check engine" light on.
Press brake pedal to step through codes:

(This is what those codes look like when displayed, and what they mean)
Tachometer/Check Engine Light/Cause
1000 rpm Off RPM sensor
1000 rpm On Knock control
2000 rpm Off Ignition timing sensor
2000 rpm On Knock Sensor
3000 rpm Off Hall sensor
3000 rpm On Intake air temp.
4000 rpm or
6000 rpm Off ECU vacuum hose or
Idle switch
4000 rpm On Coolant temp. sensor
5000 rpm Off ECU Pressure sensor
7000 rpm Off End of sequence


So that brings us to this question- what problems were you experiencing that would lead a garage to check fault codes?

full info here...

Car won't start intermittently ['87 200 Quattro Turbo]
http://www.classic-audi.co.uk/forum/...ad.php?t=32567